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Daheshville
03-06-2008, 07:08 PM
Below is the English translation of the Arabic transcript of the Doctor Dahesh audio recording we recently came in possession of.

For those of us who knew him personally, Doctor Dahesh was rather famous for neither preaching nor giving speeches.

But every now and then, when he'd reach a boiling point from having quietly watched those —who should know better—think he is naive ... or... that he has no clue what they are doing or thinking... Doctor Dahesh would remind them of who he was, that he knows what they are thinking, that there is nothing they can hide from him.

We think this speech was recorded by Doctor Dahesh himself in 1980.
We also believe that this message was heard by the Daheshists on June 1, 1980, in Beirut.

Chronologically speaking, and if we are correct in our assessment with regard to the date this message was first delivered, then it would make sense that Doctor Dahesh, already upset by the fact some were becoming potential "shakers of the faith", would make the following declaration (http://www.daheshville.com/forum/showpost.php?p=865&postcount=1).

Now, what constitutes a "Shaker of the faith" ?

It may be any individual or group whose ambitions include causing the breakup of what once was a united and cohesive Daheshist Mission under Doctor Dahesh's watchful eye.

Evidently, Doctor Dahesh began to feel the presence of this evil force brewing in the minds of some of the Daheshists.


"My Brothers and my Sisters,


I greet you with spiritual love, hoping that the Divine Power shields you from the dangers, and steers you away from the troubles, and preserves you for the day with extreme heat that is inescapable.

I say "the day with extreme heat" because we live in a world conquered by Evil and ruled by injustices, and overpowered by dark spirits whose concern is attacking the holy and persecute the faiths, and you all no doubt remember the transgressor Bechara El Khoury, that tyrant who had bullied and became arrogant and attacked my freedom which was given to me by THE ALMIGHTY CREATOR .

However, I was not neglectful and my determination did not rest, and I did not delay in attacking the opportunist greedy criminal with a fierce attack, which the books have recorded, and the logs have noted, and which crossed all corners of the Earth and both big and small, old and young, would come to know it, and the tongues transmitted it, and stoned that degenerate with terms akin to him.


For he who cooks the poison eats it, even if the elite battalions of the Inferno rely upon him.

Your faith oh Brothers and Sisters, is extended from Heaven it is firm as the tallest mountains.

And know that each one who is neglectful shall receive his punishment sooner or later.

For the Eye of GOD is watching him, and his conscience will judge him,and then woe then woe to him.

GOD gives leeway and he does not overlook.

And it is an obscenity for the believer in the lofty faith to put his hand upon the plow and then to let go of it.

(That) Judas Iscariot, (he) who betrayed his Lord and Teacher Christ, squeals in the bottom-most part of the depths of the Inferno, and he is pacing its cells (that are) raging with fires with eternal flames he requests death, and Death avoids him (with the expression of disdain on Death's face), punishment that is according to his despicable treason, let alone the tongues of the people of the Earthly Globe who curse him with curses that shake (him to his core), because he is a traitor who deserves eternal suffering.


I mentioned this because Fluids of lowly evil are trying to sow their lowly seeds in some of the heads/minds.

I will not mention names.

The "shaker" of the Faith knows himself whether man or woman.


That is why I send this (my)warning for (I) fear (the befalling of) disaster
(upon) whomever Satan has put in their heads (the idea) to sway from the straight path.

Their movements and their words and their deeds and their thoughts are (perfectly) known.

And their remorse will not do them any good once the appalling disaster happens

And he who warns cannot be blamed.

And peace may be upon you, Oh dear brothers And may you be blessed"

Johnson
03-10-2008, 04:45 PM
Truly a powerful and moving piece... thank you again for the tireless work in translating...

Loup Solitaire
03-10-2008, 05:28 PM
Below is the English translation of the Arabic transcript of the Doctor Dahesh audio recording we recently came in possession of.





For those of us who knew him personally, Doctor Dahesh was rather famous for neither preaching nor giving speeches.

But every now and then, when he'd reach a boiling point from having quietly watched those —who should know better—think he is naive ... or... that he has no clue what they are doing or thinking... Doctor Dahesh would remind them of who he was, that he knows what they are thinking, that there is nothing they can hide from him.

We think this speech was recorded by Doctor Dahesh himself in 1980.
We also believe that this message was heard by the Daheshists on June 1, 1980, in Beirut.

Chronologically speaking, and if we are correct in our assessment with regard to the date this message was first delivered, then it would make sense that Doctor Dahesh, already upset by the fact some were becoming potential "shakers of the faith", would make the following declaration (http://www.daheshville.com/forum/showpost.php?p=865&postcount=1).

Now, what constitute a "Shaker of the faith" ?

It may be any individual or group whose ambitions include causing the breakup of what once was a united and cohesive Daheshist Mission under Doctor Dahesh's watchful eye.

Evidently, Doctor Dahesh began to feel the presence of this evil force brewing in the minds of some of the Daheshists.


"My Brothers and my Sisters,


I greet you with spiritual love, hoping that the Divine Power shields you from the dangers, and steers you away from the troubles, and preserves you for the day with extreme heat that is inescapable.I say "the day with extreme heat" because we live in a world conquered by Evil and ruled by injustices, and overpowered by dark spirits whose concern is attacking the holy and persecute the faiths, and you all no doubt remember the transgressor Bechara El Khoury, that tyrant who had bullied and became arrogant and attacked my freedom which was given to me by THE ALMIGHTY CREATOR .

However, I was not neglectful and my determination did not rest, and I did not delay in attacking the opportunist greedy criminal with a fierce attack, which the books have recorded, and the logs have noted, and which crossed all corners of the Earth and both big and small, old and young, would come to know it, and the tongues transmitted it, and stoned that degenerate with terms akin to him.


For he who cooks the poison eats it, even if the elite battalions of the Inferno rely upon him.

Your faith oh Brothers and Sisters, is extended from Heaven it is firm as the tallest mountains.

And know that each one who is neglectful shall receive his punishment sooner or later.

For the Eye of GOD is watching him, and his conscience will judge him,and then woe then woe to him.

GOD gives leeway and he does not overlook.

And it is an obscenity for the believer in the lofty faith to put his hand upon the plow and then to let go of it.

(That) Judas Iscariot, (he) who betrayed his Lord and Teacher Christ, squeals in the bottom-most part of the depths of the Inferno, and he is pacing its cells (that are) raging with fires with eternal flames he requests death, and Death avoids him (with the expression of disdain on Death's face), punishment that is according to his despicable treason, let alone the tongues of the people of the Earthly Globe who curse him with curses that shake (him to his core), because he is a traitor who deserves eternal suffering.


I mentioned this because Fluids of lowly evil are trying to sow their lowly seeds in some of the heads/minds.

I will not mention names.

The "shaker" of the Faith knows himself whether man or woman.


That is why I send this (my)warning for (I) fear (the befalling of) disaster
(upon) whomever Satan has put in their heads (the idea) to sway from the straight path.

Their movements and their words and their deeds and their thoughts are (perfectly) known.

And their remorse will not do them any good once the appalling disaster happens

And he who warns cannot be blamed.

And peace may be upon you, Oh dear brothers And may you be blessed"


How curious it seems to me that Dr Dahesh seemed to think that this group would continue on in his absence with the same vigor and dedication. Yet absent an acknowledged, accepted and active leader it seems severely handicapped. I see what is happening here and I see what information Mounir is trying to disseminate. People seem reluctant to embrace openly some of the extreme possibilities for mankind if people practice forcefully and faithfully.

Johnson
03-11-2008, 04:02 PM
How curious it seems to me that Dr Dahesh seemed to think that this group would continue on in his absence with the same vigor and dedication. Yet absent an acknowledged, accepted and active leader it seems severely handicapped. I see what is happening here and I see what information Mounir is trying to disseminate. People seem reluctant to embrace openly some of the extreme possibilities for mankind if people practice forcefully and faithfully.

Within the scheme of God, the Universe, and His Prophets... all things are known... even the thoughts and intentions within ourselves before we even know them ourselves... each of us have free will, yet still, all things are known... this is a concept, that beyond some intellectual gymnastics, we will never truly comprehend.

In some ways, I imagine some pockets of "this group" have continued on in his absence with even greater vigor and dedication... others, seemingly... not so much. There is, and always has been only one rightful leader of the Daheshists. And until further spiritual notice, and whether she or anyone else likes or acknowledges it... this is the way things are. We recognize and respect her position as such.

I think the three real "handicaps" among certain Daheshists are:

1) Entitlement
2) Apathy
3) Entitlement

I have witnessed this entitlement and arrogance first hand... numerous times... This self righteous, better than thou and more right than thou... is to my mind, very much a piece, even if not part of the central reference of what Dr. Dahesh is talking about.

The apathy and "keeping silent" issue has been talked about numerous times here on Daheshville. There are many things in the last 20 years that need to be addressed... there are many apologies and forgivenesses that need to take place...

None the less... none of this changes the significance, power or importance of the truth of who Dr. Dahesh was and is. It does not degrade the message or wealth of information and legacy that has been entrusted to us.

Ghandi said, in response to being asked what he thought about Christianity:

"I like your Christ, I do not like your Christians. Your Christians are so unlike your Christ."

We the people can potentially mess everything up... yet, the Spiritual Message shall always and forever exist... in the proper truth as it was meant to exist. If we mess things up, we mess things up for ourselves... if we follow in the wrong direction... so we shall reap what we sow... What our prophet Dr. Dahesh delivered to us was ultimately in the end... a means to better understand the workings of the world we know and the worlds we don't know, so that we can find the path to make ourselves better spiritual beings. That is pretty much it.

Despite all this... everyone will come along in there own due time... wether there is formal organization or not... wether or not everything looks right or pretty or not... wether we have Dr. Dahesh's books published in English or not... all we can do, is make sure that the information that we present, as well as come across, is accurate and true to the mission and message left to us by Dr. Dahesh.

Daheshville
03-13-2008, 07:07 PM
How curious it seems to me that Dr Dahesh seemed to think that this group would continue on in his absence with the same vigor and dedication. Yet absent an acknowledged, accepted and active leader it seems severely handicapped. I see what is happening here and I see what information Mounir is trying to disseminate. People seem reluctant to embrace openly some of the extreme possibilities for mankind if people practice forcefully and faithfully.

The question is whether or not he believed in "this group" or whether he knew that —no matter what— Daheshism will spread.

In other words: what must be will be?

As to who —among "this group"— shall fall to temptation (the nature of which is clearly laid out in his speech) that is up to the individual to resist it.

To the best of our research, we cannot find one instance where Doctor Dahesh is discussing the future of the Daheshists in particular.

Yes, he talked about the duties of a Daheshist and what means to be a Daheshist (see WORDS), etc. But to assume that he actually had hopes IN the Daheshists... Only God can tell us what he truly believed, felt, or saw...

Furthermore, why did he, towards the end, pretty much distance himself from everyone, if indeed he had hope? Doesn't make you wonder why he would die, practically alone, in a bed to which he was confined for 40 agonizing days as people went about their business?

So, to recap: Which Daheshists (whether newly entering the faith or from "this group") shall be part of the solution versus the problem, that is totally up to them.

A spiritual message transcends all boundaries. Mere mortals, on the other hand, do not. Nothing we do or say will change the fact that Daheshism will spread. Nothing... True, our thoughts and actions may make the journey easier, and even change the course of history, or even delay the inevitable "rebooting" ...

As surely as the sun will set tonight, Daheshism will rise tomorrow.

God gives Man an opportunity to work for a worthy cause, whatever that cause might be (save the whales, the planet, etc.)

"This Group" was given an opportunity to work for Daheshism. With or without "This Group," Daheshism will reach the place it is destined to reach.

And, in case anyone is wondering where "Daheshville" sees itself in all of this:

We just report the news and tell it as it is.

And, speaking of which:

Daheshism can never be led by anyone who is voted into office as the result of political campaign where spin doctors work relentlessly to achieve one thing and one thing only: success of their candidate.

Unlike yogurt, in standard politics creme does not always rise to the top.

True, whoever will succeed the current leader has to be chosen by a vote. But imagine if one candidate defames his or her "opponent"... Would that be noble?

Therefore, nobility is key. Otherwise Daheshism will no longer be a Holy Message, instead, it will degenerate into the abyss of the obscene, as once Doctor Dahesh exclaimed— after he could no longer hold in his frustration with how a handful of Daheshists were behaving—while being guests in the house of the person who later would become the Doctor's inheritor (along with her family).

Until then, the leader of the Daheshists is the leader for a host of reasons, including many revealed truths about her reincarnations.

So, like it or not, she is the leader.

It does not matter if she doesn't want to be the leader anymore.

Can a mother stop being a mother? Even if she abandons her home (for whatever reason and after years of dedication to it) she will always be the mother.

And in any family, there must be true love.

Diplomacy? Yes. But standard politics? No.

Anyone who believes is going to Paradise simply because he or she recruited the greatest number of Daheshists possible, is concerned with the bottom line and nothing else.

And anyone who evokes past reincarnations in order to convince others to follow them is brainwashing them.

You see, not even the person we recognize as being the "the leader" of the Mission (and with whom we greatly disagree and who we feel has done the Mission a great disservice and who we beg to correct history ) dared evoke her past reincarnations!

When her back was against the wall and she had to get things done, she evoked the Doctor's Will, which gave her and her family full control of everything he wrote and collected. You, I, and everyone here would have done the same.

In addition, anyone with half a legal brain will tell you that a Will is a legal document and as such, it cannot discuss things that have no tangible or market value. Therefore, do not expect a Will to say anything about any Mission or Spiritual Message.

But, seriously, what does it mean when the Doctor gives someone everything he owned and trusted them as he trusted no one else?

It means exactly what you think it means...

Johnson
03-18-2008, 04:30 PM
It does not matter if any of our individual or group efforts are ever recognized by ANYONE (although, a little acknowledgement or encouragement here and there is always nice...but let us not ever hold our breath(s)... we are dealing with people and ego and God only knows WHAT after all...)

All that matters is that we as individuals and we as a group... TRIED TO DO SOMETHING RIGHT. Our level of effectiveness, with an honest, concerted effort, is kind of irrelevant. What matters is that each of us honestly tried. We took (and continue to take) the hits and painful words levied upon us... what can we do? We can just continue to be us and stay the course.

Yes, I would love to see the seeds of Daheshism take root in people... frankly, I would love to see the seeds that have already taken root in the many that already call themselves Daheshists stand somewhat on a common front and share a common vision and share a mutually kind word. Yet (and I speak from personal experience here), fellow Daheshists are still maliciously maligning other Daheshists. Misguided, self serving vendettas are still being held... both in mind and heart, and also, even in print.

This has got to stop. Those "new Daheshist" and "Daheshist curious" individuals that see and may be dismayed by such actions... well, I and others are right there with you... I can't comfortably type the words that exist in my head regarding these sort of words and acts that I have continually witnessed for 20 some years now... I have seen this undue anger and scorn thrown on Mario's head, and I have had similar dumped on my head. Frankly, we are all tired of it too... but alas, for some divine reason (it was almost difficult to type that) this has been our test and trial by fire.

Yet... and here is the thing I hope people one day can take away from all this... we all have still tried to live and exist together in this community here with love, patience and understanding and a devotion to making available TRUE, HONEST and ACCURATE information about the life and legacy of Dr. Dahesh. There is nothing more important than that.

I have seen many people, some very, very close to me, reject the message of Dr. Dahesh that I was trying to convey to them. We don't convey any of this for our own sakes, we convey it because it is information that is true and honest and speaks to us... and we pray it rings true and honest and speaks to others as well... after that, their journey begins... What more can we do?

I echo Mario's take, that at least those that are told of Dr. Dahesh's message at the very least are tolerant to it. Tolerance at least implies to me a certain clarity of thought... everyone and anyone can only come along to anything in their life (spiritually or physically) in their own due course.

Loup Solitaire
03-19-2008, 02:06 PM
I received Mario's brother's, Joseph's, book a few weeks ago. I took it with me on vacation. I read most, but have a little to go. His story telling was interesting and entertaining, but the meat of the book was not as substantial as I hoped. The net effect has been enlightening. But as I said I still need to finish it.

Life is complex. Most people are consumed with the basics of living and I do not fault them for that. I can readily understand how people can be weighed down and unable to do anything other than the basics. But sustaining an effort such as this web site is not a trivial matter. However, because Mario has opened himself up to the possibilities and despite obstacles he has made a significant contribution.

Others could have made contributions with less effort.

In the case of Daheshism, it appears that most of them have taken a "vow of silence". I think we should be thankful for the few who have decided not to follow that vow.

By the way, what is the latest on the prospects of the "Art Museum" opening its' doors again? Has anything been heard? Despite personnel feelings, I think I'd like to see the art Dr Dahesh assembled.

Daheshville
05-29-2008, 07:10 AM
... based on what Daheshisme.org has published, this speech was delivered on June 1, 1980, in Beirut.

WingedPaladin
08-31-2009, 09:40 AM
http://www.nationalgeographic.com/lostgospel/document.html

Mario
09-01-2009, 03:53 PM
Assuming "Judas' Gospel" is legitimate, I cannot (personally) forget the tragic fact that this betrayed Jesus.

Furthermore, and as a way for him to redeem himself, he reincarnated as one of Doctor Dahesh' disciples who — once again — betrayed Doctor Dahesh, stole money from him and defamed him. I would try to keep that in perspective, since it all goes to his credibility (or lack thereof):

(That) Judas Iscariot, (he) who betrayed his Lord and Teacher Christ, squeals in the bottom-most part of the depths of the Inferno, and he is pacing its cells (that are) raging with fires with eternal flames he requests death, and Death avoids him (with the expression of disdain on Death's face), punishment that is according to his despicable treason, let alone the tongues of the people of the Earthly Globe who curse him with curses that shake (him to his core), because he is a traitor who deserves eternal suffering.

WingedPaladin
09-05-2009, 06:45 AM
Assuming "Judas' Gospel" is legitimate, I cannot (personally) forget the tragic fact that this betrayed Jesus.

The irony here is that it is at Jesus' own request and Jesus' crucifixion was planned since Eden.

Furthermore, and as a way for him to redeem himself, he reincarnated as one of Doctor Dahesh' disciples who — once again — betrayed Doctor Dahesh, stole money from him and defamed him. I would try to keep that in perspective, since it all goes to his credibility (or lack thereof):

Who might this individual be? How did you discover this individual's former life as Judas?

WingedPaladin
09-05-2009, 06:52 AM
Ok, I found it:

"He said: No doubt. That’s because the Order of Spiritual Causality governs the entire universe. Take for example the former Lebanese President, Bechara El-Khoury: Why he himself persecuted me and it wasn’t any of his predecessors or successors? The reason for this is that he had a Sayyal from King Herod and another Sayyal from Pilate—who both conspired to persecute Jesus Christ. Take another example of Abed el-Rahim el-Khaleely: Despite him being as one of my followers in Palestine and I trusted him to the point of having him hold whatever money I owned, he ended up betraying me, stealing the money and then defaming me. Why? It is because he has a Sayyal from Judas Iscariot that betrayed Jesus Christ and turned him in to his enemies. I knew then all that, however, I was supposed to give him a chance to repent and to overcome his bad Sayyal of betrayal. He did not benefit from the Divine Mercy." - Dr. Dahesh

Daheshist Ideology
Sayyals (Spiritual Fluids): Their meaning, types, activities, and interaction according to Daheshist concepts. Excerpts taken from an article published in Dahesh Voice magazine, Vol. 10, No. 1, 2004.
By: Dr. Ghazi Brax
Page 10

http://www.daheshism.com/Sayyals3-English.pdf

Mario
09-05-2009, 04:14 PM
The irony here is that it is at Jesus' own request and Jesus' crucifixion was planned since Eden.

According to who? Are you quoting Judas' gospel? Either way, you believe it is true.

OK, let's then go with that premise and approach this "scientifically":

Even then, and according to (most probably) a unimaginably complicated mathematical routine, someone — or rather some Spiritual Fluid — had to betray Jesus in order to fulfill the prophecy of the crucifixion that was (supposedly) planned since Eden.

In other words, the moment Adam and Eve crossed the line they shouldn't have, they introduced the component of "Probability" and "Statistical Mathematics" into what might have been a much simpler (Mathematical) system.

To us human, these may appear as reflections of a universe run by chance. But in reality, they are not — and here, I digress and I don't want to go off topic.

In any case, "Statistically-speaking" someone had to do it. If not Judas, it would have certainly been someone else. And, if it so happened that no disciple of Jesus Christ had caused the configuration of his Spiritual Fluids to be attracted towards that (proverbial) "Black Hole" (becoming the betrayer) of which there would have been (apparently) no escape, then — who knows — none of us would have been here... Earth would not even been here... In other words, this whole "level" known as Planet Earth (and all the associated perceptions and illusions — time, space etc. ) might not have been necessary.



Who might this individual be? How did you discover this individual's former life as Judas?

Abd (or Abed) El Raheem El Khaleely. Doctor Dahesh himself gave me the thick red book that was published about him. It was filled with letter, photographs... evidence... over evidence... And in the spirit of full disclosure: That book in question did not credit "Doctor Dahesh" as the author.

Also, several other books that Doctor Dahesh gave me featured this man.

Last but not least: Doctor Dahesh's own INFERNO (the book, of which I have a copy). There are many chilling and graphic descriptions about the fate awaiting him (at the time, he was still alive... and I am referring to the early 1980's... And he held some sort of Government post. In any case, the book was very well circulated)

I hope that answers your question.

Ok, I found it:

"He said: No doubt. That’s because the Order of Spiritual Causality governs the entire universe. Take for example the former Lebanese President, Bechara El-Khoury: Why he himself persecuted me and it wasn’t any of his predecessors or successors? The reason for this is that he had a Sayyal from King Herod and another Sayyal from Pilate—who both conspired to persecute Jesus Christ. Take another example of Abed el-Rahim el-Khaleely: Despite him being as one of my followers in Palestine and I trusted him to the point of having him hold whatever money I owned, he ended up betraying me, stealing the money and then defaming me. Why? It is because he has a Sayyal from Judas Iscariot that betrayed Jesus Christ and turned him in to his enemies. I knew then all that, however, I was supposed to give him a chance to repent and to overcome his bad Sayyal of betrayal. He did not benefit from the Divine Mercy." - Dr. Dahesh

Daheshist Ideology
Sayyals (Spiritual Fluids): Their meaning, types, activities, and interaction according to Daheshist concepts. Excerpts taken from an article published in Dahesh Voice magazine, Vol. 10, No. 1, 2004.
By: Dr. Ghazi Brax
Page 10

http://www.daheshism.com/Sayyals3-English.pdf

I have no idea what "Sayyals" means in English... Is it in the Dictionary?

I know there that in Arabic we say "Sayyaalaat Roohiyyat" (to denote "Spiritual Fluids") but "Sayyals?" ... or "Sayyal"... ?

Doctor Dahesh was known for being a purist when it came to languages. In fact, when Doctor Dahesh was still alive, and when anything related to Daheshism was translated into English or French, you always saw "Spiritual Fluid" or "Fluide Spirituel."

Even Dr. Brax's last lecture in Belgium (the original, the one published in 1986 by The Daheshist Publishing Company) cites "Spiritual Fluids."

But, all that aside (and I know you're quoting faithfully something that has been published by others): is Daheshism an Ideology?

As a point of interest, and I just re-checked, Doctor Dahesh in his introduction to "Strange Stories and Wondrous Legends, Volume 2" and after citing several examples that show how we might logically conclude that (among others) Judaism, Christianity, and Islam actually support reincarnation, writes (in a paragraph title):

"Our Theory of Reincarnation is as Follows:"

Ideology is (as per Webster's):
1 : visionary theorizing
2 a : a systematic body of concepts especially about human life or culture b : a manner or the content of thinking characteristic of an individual, group, or culture c : the integrated assertions, theories and aims that constitute a sociopolitical program
But, see, Doctor Dahesh, in the beginning of that same introduction, confirms that none of these stories were fictional. Hence, from his perspective, there was no "Visionary Theorizing"

And since he cannot force his beliefs on others, he presented his beliefs as theory. Which is exactly how Einstein presented his belief in Relativity. Am I not correct?

And, might Daheshism give rise (in the future) to certain number of ideologies? Sure. I mean, look at the number of ideologies that spawned as the result of how certain people interpreted (for example) the Holy Books.

Maybe I am wrong. But for what it's worth, Daheshism is a Faith which was founded by Doctor Dahesh, a Prophet. It will eventually develop into an ORGANIZED Religion — ORGANIZED religions being the mother of all necessary evils, I suppose.

And (incidentally) anyone who claims that ALL of Doctor Dahesh's writings should be taken at face value, applied AS IS, to the letter, without INTERPRETATION, or MENTAL EXERCISE, didn't get it the possibility that the information locked within his writings is much, much greater than the total sum of its parts. In fact, just in "WORDS" — and on face value alone — there are several contradictions.

Yet... if we take the time and reflect... the truth reveals itself. In any case...

WingedPaladin
09-05-2009, 10:26 PM
Abd (or Abed) El Raheem El Khaleely. Doctor Dahesh himself gave me the thick red book that was published about him. It was filled with letter, photographs... evidence... over evidence... And in the spirit of full disclosure: That book in question did not credit "Doctor Dahesh" as the author.

Also, several other books that Doctor Dahesh gave me featured this man.

Last but not least: Doctor Dahesh's own INFERNO (the book, of which I have a copy). There are many chilling and graphic descriptions about the fate awaiting him (at the time, he was still alive... and I am referring to the early 1980's... And he held some sort of Government post. In any case, the book was very well circulated)

I hope that answers your question.

Thank you for answering my question.

According to who? Are you quoting Judas' gospel?

To answer your question, here are my sources:

Yes, partially from Judas' gospel and scripture:

"Jesus answered, He it is, to whom I shall give a sop, when I have dipped it. And when he had dipped the sop, he gave it to Judas Iscariot, the son of Simon.
And after the sop Satan entered into him. Then said Jesus unto him, That thou doest, do quickly.
Now no man at the table knew for what intent he spake this unto him." (John 13:26-28)

I wonder how John knew Satan entered into Judas. Did he see Satan there? Did Jesus tell him this? Did John infer and assume this when he wrote about it already knowing the outcome? Is it a priest's or translator's embellishment? Not enough information here.

Early Prophesies of Jesus:

Isaiah's prophesies of Jesus' sufferings: http://scriptures.lds.org/en/isa/53/3-12#3
Lehi's prophesies of Jesus' sufferings: http://scriptures.lds.org/en/1_ne/10/11

It is LDS doctrine that Adam was promised a Messiah after his Fall and that a Redeemer was already planned in the eventuality of a Fall.

Dr. George King's commentary* concerning Jesus' involvement in bringing about His own death. Judas is not directly mentioned here. (posted on another site for bandwidths sake.)


In any case, "Statistically-speaking" someone had to do it. If not Judas, it would have certainly been someone else. And, if it so happened that no disciple of Jesus Christ had caused the configuration of his Spiritual Fluids to be attracted towards that (proverbial) "Black Hole" (becoming the betrayer) of which there would have been (apparently) no escape, then — who knows — none of us would have been here... Earth would not even been here... In other words, this whole "level" known as Planet Earth (and all the associated perceptions and illusions — time, space etc. ) might not have been necessary.


Interesting perspective.

There are two scenarios here then regarding Judas. The first being Judas was influenced by the dark and betrayed Jesus of his own accord as is commonly believed and the second where Jesus took Judas aside, revealed to Judas what his role and mission was (probably not a far stretch from how Joseph Smith felt when commanded to practice polygamy - damned if you do and damned worse if you don't), and later reminded and/or commanded him to go and do when the right moment came. The second scenario paints a different theoretical picture of intent behind the kiss. Instead of it being one of betrayal, it could be one of remorse, sacrifice, love, faithfulness to Jesus' hidden agenda of bringing the crucifixion to fruition, and his last goodbye. Is Judas the great villain history has painted him to be or a hero who sacrificed his own soul for the greater good and condemned himself to Hell under the weight of the responsibility and reputation of being used as a prime example of betrayal?

As you have said, Daheshism seems to agree with the commonly known historical account.

Mario
09-05-2009, 11:54 PM
As you have said, Daheshism seems to agree with the commonly known historical account.

Please be specific: What "commonly known historical account" did I cite?
And I don't think I cited any such account.

And I certainly did not — at any time — promote the idea or even the scenario that Judas was a "hero who sacrificed his own soul"

Go back and re-read what I posted:

Being that you believed in the Gospel of Judas (your premise), I used my Daheshist experience and weaved a theoretical model based on a premise you hold to be true — that the Gospel of Judas was credible, or truthful, and so on.

If you study correctly what I wrote, I (basically) said that *someone* or *some spiritual fluid* (as as a result of the-now statistical aspect of our existence) was bound to be (and here I paraphrase) the one to commit that crime and be cursed for all eternity.

And once again, the Gospel of Judas contradicts what Doctor Dahesh said.

Here, let me quote Doctor Dahesh:

"(That) Judas Iscariot, (he) who betrayed his Lord and Teacher Christ, squeals in the bottom-most part of the depths of the Inferno, and he is pacing its cells (that are) raging with fires with eternal flames he requests death, and Death avoids him (with the expression of disdain on Death's face), punishment that is according to his despicable treason, let alone the tongues of the people of the Earthly Globe who curse him with curses that shake (him to his core), because he is a traitor who deserves eternal suffering."

Once again, and as a reminder to you, this is Daheshville. In Daheshville, the words of Doctor Dahesh outweigh the words of Judas.

WingedPaladin
09-06-2009, 12:55 AM
Please be specific: What "commonly known historical account" did I cite? And I don't think I cited any such account.

I am referring to the biblical account and the widespread belief held that Judas was a vile traitor.

And I certainly did not — at any time — promote the idea or even the scenario that Judas was a "hero who sacrificed his own soul"

I did not insinuate that you had. I am investigating the alternative explanation/perspective to the Judas phenomenon given the new evidence of an ancient record.

Once again, and as a reminder to you, this is Daheshville. In Daheshville, the words of Doctor Dahesh outweigh the words of Judas.

Of course, and the words of you, me, or anyone else for that matter.

If one-sided opinion and viewpoint is the case, what is the purpose of a forum? Daheshville should be a static website about Dr. Dahesh instead of a forum if the admin chooses to be intolerant of the alternative and diverse views of current and potential members that come from many different backgrounds, belief systems, bodies of knowledge, paradigms, etc.

WingedPaladin
09-06-2009, 01:31 AM
In high school, I read the book "Grendel (http://www.amazon.com/Grendel-John-Gardner/dp/0679723110/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1252211226&sr=8-1)" which is the Beowulf story from the monster's point of view. The idea is to add a level of understanding, compassion, and empathy for the portrayed antagonist.

Mario
09-06-2009, 01:49 AM
I am referring to the biblical account and the widespread belief held that Judas was a vile traitor.

You did not make that clear. You made it sound as if I was agreeing with you. I don't.



I did not insinuate that you had. I am investigating the alternative explanation/perspective to the Judas phenomenon given the new evidence of an ancient record.

Noted and you've made your opinion known. You were allowed to post (basically) an opposing point of view. Hold that thought.



Of course, and the words of you, me, or anyone else for that matter.

If one-sided opinion and viewpoint is the case, what is the purpose of a forum? Daheshville should be a static website about Dr. Dahesh instead of a forum if the admin chooses to be intolerant of the alternative and diverse views of current and potential members that come from many different backgrounds, belief systems, bodies of knowledge, paradigms, etc.

Not sure I understand the question...

Daheshville is a Daheshist School. Sure, it offers a forum as part of the experience of experiencing Daheshism through (so far) Sandrine and myself, the two co-founders of Daheshville.

Your opinion has been heard and a verdict rendered. We are fully acting within our rights. We broke no agreement.

Your opinion has been clearly noted. It's there... in plain view.

As for George King: I already asked you to stop promoting this group.

How could you promote this group again, especially after the hell we've been through with you as the result of your insisting on promoting him on Daheshville (and might I add, none of the messages were deleted!) ?

And, how could you after making a promise?!
http://www.daheshville.com/forum/showpost.php?p=4028&postcount=36

Go back and review that whole section.

At least I NEVER lied to you. None of us here did. You were always told what to expect.

You were told, ordered, instructed, whatever, to NEVER promote ANYTHING by George King.

You promised you wouldn't.

You broke your promise.

End of story.

Mario
09-06-2009, 02:02 AM
In high school, I read the book "Grendel (http://www.amazon.com/Grendel-John-Gardner/dp/0679723110/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1252211226&sr=8-1)" which is the Beowulf story from the monster's point of view. The idea is to add a level of understanding, compassion, and empathy for the portrayed antagonist.

Understanding, compassion, and empathy are all irrelevant here.

This thread is about what Doctor Dahesh said in his speech.

In his speech, he revealed the irrevocable and final ruling as far as Judas was concerned.

Questioning that is tantamount to questioning Divine Justice: In other words, this has nothing with what Doctor Dahesh may or may not think.

He's just the messenger.

But, we get it. You don't agree.

Duly noted and thank you.

This matter is now closed. And you know that I mean what I say...

WingedPaladin
09-06-2009, 02:11 AM
At least I NEVER lied to you. None of us here did. You were always told what to expect.

You were told, ordered, instructed, whatever, to NEVER promote ANYTHING by George King.

You promised you wouldn't.

You broke your promise.

End of story.

You asked me a question, "According to who?" and I answered it fully and honestly. You prefer me to lie and hide the truth? You prefer to constrict me because I consider more than one side to every story? Perhaps Daheshville should omit #6 from the Daheshist Charter (http://www.daheshville.com/forum/showpost.php?p=2587&postcount=1) if this is the stand it is going to take.

Mario
09-06-2009, 02:27 AM
You asked me a question, "According to who?" and I answered it fully and honestly. You prefer me to lie and hide the truth? You prefer to constrict me because I consider more than one side to every story? Perhaps Daheshville should omit #6 from the Daheshist Charter (http://www.daheshville.com/forum/showpost.php?p=2587&postcount=1) if this is the stand it is going to take.

Whether you lie or not (to use your words) is your business.

I expect you to stick to your word and to keep your promises.

If you knew — from the start — that posting certain things were off limits to you, then that's your problem.

You could have just posted his name. And, in case you have not noticed, I did not remove the words "George King."

But, no. You had to break your promise and post the link.

Never make promises you can't keep — in Daheshville, anyway.

Daheshville
09-06-2009, 03:55 AM
As of a few minutes ago, and pursuant to the comments you sent, and without going into it again and wasting both our times, the following decision has been taken:

You have been moved to the "Auditing (Read Only) Member" Status.

For old time's sake, you will be given full access to Dahehville.
But you will no longer have the ability to submit messages.

Thank you for all these *wonderful* years of discussions and ... all that.

But this is where we say goodbye.

Loup Solitaire
07-14-2010, 06:24 PM
Below is the English translation of the Arabic transcript of the Doctor Dahesh audio recording we recently came in possession of.

For those of us who knew him personally, Doctor Dahesh was rather famous for neither preaching nor giving speeches.

But every now and then, when he'd reach a boiling point from having quietly watched those —who should know better—think he is naive ... or... that he has no clue what they are doing or thinking... Doctor Dahesh would remind them of who he was, that he knows what they are thinking, that there is nothing they can hide from him.........


Chronologically speaking, and if we are correct in our assessment with regard to the date this message was first delivered, then it would make sense that Doctor Dahesh, already upset by the fact some were becoming potential "shakers of the faith", would make the following declaration (http://www.daheshville.com/forum/showpost.php?p=865&postcount=1).

Now, what constitutes a "Shaker of the faith" ?

It may be any individual or group whose ambitions include causing the breakup of what once was a united and cohesive Daheshist Mission under Doctor Dahesh's watchful eye.

Evidently, Doctor Dahesh began to feel the presence of this evil force brewing in the minds of some of the Daheshist.

"The Warning!"

"My Brothers and my Sisters,


I greet you with spiritual love, hoping that the Divine Power shields you from the dangers, and steers you away from the troubles, and preserves you for the day with extreme heat that is inescapable.

I say "the day with extreme heat" because we live in a world conquered by Evil and ruled by injustices, and overpowered by dark spirits whose concern is attacking the holy and persecute the faiths, and you all no doubt remember the transgressor Bechara El Khoury, that tyrant who had bullied and became arrogant and attacked my freedom which was given to me by THE ALMIGHTY CREATOR .

However, I was not neglectful and my determination did not rest, and I did not delay in attacking the opportunist greedy criminal with a fierce attack, which the books have recorded, and the logs have noted, and which crossed all corners of the Earth and both big and small, old and young, would come to know it, and the tongues transmitted it, and stoned that degenerate with terms akin to him.


For he who cooks the poison eats it, even if the elite battalions of the Inferno rely upon him.

Your faith oh Brothers and Sisters, is extended from Heaven it is firm as the tallest mountains.

And know that each one who is neglectful shall receive his punishment sooner or later.

For the Eye of GOD is watching him, and his conscience will judge him,and then woe then woe to him.

GOD gives leeway and he does not overlook.

And it is an obscenity for the believer in the lofty faith to put his hand upon the plow and then to let go of it.

(That) Judas Iscariot, (he) who betrayed his Lord and Teacher Christ, squeals in the bottom-most part of the depths of the Inferno, and he is pacing its cells (that are) raging with fires with eternal flames he requests death, and Death avoids him (with the expression of disdain on Death's face), punishment that is according to his despicable treason, let alone the tongues of the people of the Earthly Globe who curse him with curses that shake (him to his core), because he is a traitor who deserves eternal suffering.


I mentioned this because Fluids of lowly evil are trying to sow their lowly seeds in some of the heads/minds.

I will not mention names.

The "shaker" of the Faith knows himself whether man or woman.


That is why I send this (my)warning for (I) fear (the befalling of) disaster
(upon) whomever Satan has put in their heads (the idea) to sway from the straight path.

Their movements and their words and their deeds and their thoughts are (perfectly) known.

And their remorse will not do them any good once the appalling disaster happens

And he who warns cannot be blamed.

And peace may be upon you, Oh dear brothers And may you be blessed"


When I first read this post, I thought it was powerful.

And then, in the last day or so, spontaneously, I recalled vaguely the warning and appeal contained in this very powerful message. I was not simply thinking about the things written in Daheshville or Dr Dahesh. But a thought interrupted my train of thinking while I was busy working on a project. That thought was simplistic, succinct, but powerful. But I was on the clock and had a project to finish.

Then when I had a few free minutes, I attempted to recall where I had read the warning that reverberated in my head. At first I thought it was in "The Will". But that was written in Arabic only. And I don't read Arabic. But in trying to recall the post with "the Will", I found the entry containing "The Warning". I think some people need to heed this.